Wednesday, 15 December 2010

Another unhappy day for Labor. When will they learn?

18 comments:

Tyson Hayter said...

lol, they won't.

Carl Butcher said...

If Queenslanders vote our state Labor government back in again I'll seriously consider moving. This state is going backwards under Labor.

Andrew Tunney said...

You've got to be kidding?!?!?! A fee to fish?

Labor are trying to lose aren't they? This has been tossed around before and it was resoundingly thrown out. Any Government that introduces that in QLD is set for an almighty defeat.

You've really got to wonder how far labor are in their Green masters pockets with this sort of stupidity. Where does all our boat and trailer rego go and what is this achieving?

Paul Christie said...

‎@Andrew o yea it is SO stupid to try to work out a way to maintain a sustainable fish population, cause i mean your not going to need them to be there in 50 years are you....O yea.. thats right rec fisherman are so selfless and sustainable they only take a freezer load at a time..
right wing nut jobs have the most ludicrous logic i have ever encountered.
1. Greenies who spend their lives fighting to preserve the existence, value and status of the environmental "commons" are greedy. Do you have any idea what "commons"mean.. it relates to an environmental asset we wish ALL our children (not just the children of greenies) will inherit..
2. The right wing of politics will look after your interest...
morons they couldnt care less if the general population was destitute as long as big business is making a profit and the sheeple are suckered in, scared, distracted and debt ridden...

GO THE GREENS

Andrew Tunney said...

And that's the key Paul, sustainability - no one disagrees on that point.

To be honest I don't know too many fisho's who take 'freezer loads' of fish anymore. More and more it's a case of take only what you can eat and return the rest. I don't doubt what you say does happen but it's unfair to tar all fisho's with the one brush.

The labor governments are simply adopting the green attitude which seems to be lock out all fishermen or make it so expensive that the majority cannot participate which is disappointing to say the least.

Need we remind you good green folk that fishing is a major contributor to the FNQ economy. Dare I ask once we are all taxed or locked out of our chosen hobby, what is going to replace this sector or is this like the headline a few months back in the Cairns Post: "go join the unemployment queue"?

Tyson Hayter said...

Oooh yeah, go the Greens. Woo-hoo for taxpayer funded free sex changes. And Heroin on the PBS! Actual policies.

If the Greens understood the economy existed and came up with practical and pragmatic policy rather than absolutist rhetoric, maybe they'd be taken seriously.

Paul Christie said...

‎@tyson..unless you want to be regarded as a fool you should really get the wording right when talking about Greens Policies..
"make drug substitution treatments available under the Pharmaceutical Benefits Scheme, and compensate pharmacists for costs of dispensing treatment."

substitution of drugs...means methadone programs etc not heroin fool.

regarding sex changes...it would be a sad and probably quite dangerous world if we had to force people to conform to one "right" way to be sexually, especially after compassionate studies from leading mental health researches have found distressing issues surrounding repressed sexuality...
maybe that could be were your anger comes from???
the wording mentions nothing about funding sex changes...

"support gender assignment for people born with an intersex condition being made only when they are able to express personal sexual identity."

The thing is that the word Economy means "the system" it has only been through the rise of the corporation and the demise of the critical thinking independent citizen that the economy has just come to mean financial transactions....
On what,and with what do we do these financial transactions....
on the earth with resources that have all 100% come from the natural environment.in short..a one in a billion planet with "finite resources"....or dont you care about what sort of world your grandkids will inherit...the right wing reeks of selfish greedy individuals totally devoid of genuine compassion and cursed with extreme short sightedness.

The bottom line is that the Greens are a compassionate dynamic, progressive Integral thinking party that scares small closed minded, prejudice bigoted brainwashed fools.
those that wish to remain in a world of masters and slaves that is slowly devouring itself...
They will mix the words and put them out of context as often as they can to constantly reinforce their pathetic selfish logic.
GO THE GREENS

Tyson Hayter said...

LOL. Just lol. So short on substance that you have to resort to insults. That's pretty sad. I'll dignify your diatribe with a response when your parliamentary delegation is larger than my immediate family.

Alex Godineau said...

Im guessing Pauls a green and tysons not... No matter who gets voted or is in charge theres always someone unhappy, why waste your time arguing whos political party is better/worse on facebook.

Paul Christie said...

why do anything Alex...who cares right i mean the whole political story is already stiched up...might as well go back to watching the soap operas and dreaming of my retirement.

@ tyson i refuted with evidence your misinformed understanding of two green policies you thought you could misrepresent and demonize due inherent ignorance, prejudice and profound lack of compassion and understanding of the bigger picture...
if you regard that as a lack of substance you are only parroting the response given by all those who regard their story is true and infallible and any evidence to the con-try either you just dont hear (or in this case read) or scream louder than the messenger so the truth is obscured by a personality contest..
pretty boaring argument hey...lets get back to drinking beer and fishing the ocean till its empty....
your last comment just illustrates your totally blindness to the duopoly we here in Australia call democracy, the twiddle dee twiddle dum scenario might suit your level of intelligence but it sure as hell is demeaning for a lot of us...

Bryan Law said...

Hey Paul! Is the ALP, using state power to compel obedience, REALLY the tool needed to create aware, sustainable community. I don't think so. The current Greens leadership has, however, chosen to go down that path. (Mighty white of them).

Everyone has part of the truth, and we shall see how it all goes.

Meanwhile, a quote for you from the Rubaiyat of Omar Kayam:

Ah, Love! could you and I with Him conspire
To grasp this sorry Scheme of Things entire,
Would not we shatter it to bits--and then
Re-mould it nearer to the Heart's Desire!

Andrew Tunney said...

Paul, the fact of the matter is that the day we lose the will to be concerned what our (so called) political leaders want / do is the day that we lose our freedom as a society; and the disenchantment of the electorate with the major parties was evident at the end of the last election.

However, after doing so research on your posts (mainly on Mike's web site); it would seem that you have a tendency to blast both barrels against anyone who would have a difference of opinion to what you believe.

If we were to take your comments as a broad overview of the Greens ideals with regards to anyone who disagrees with them, then it comes across as very little other than the “sarcastic bitchiness of a spoiled teenager”. This leaves very little doubt in my mind as to why people such as Tyson perceive you and the Greens in general as not being able to be taken seriously. Your comments are purely confrontational, derogatory and will not facilitate any healthy debate.

I respect that you are passionate about what you believe in but, please; show a little maturity in your arguments and don’t talk down to people. Diagnosing Tyson as a fool with possible mental issues arising from an apparent repressed sexuality does nothing but show you as a “loose cannon”; these are just not comments that you make in the public domain rebutting arguments in an intelligent adult debate trying to advance the Greens cause. Tyson certainly did not make any similar disparaging comments concerning you personally.

Your comments regarding the economy seem to indicate that you prefer Australia to be to a closed market economy, as you seem to feel that the capitalist system is a bad thing. Now you may have a point here (depending on how you look at it), however this is not going to change any time soon as most of the free world also embraces this system. Doing this would see our economy destroyed in a manner I don’t want to even speculate. Still, this is heading off topic and that debate can occur another day!

The Greens need to work with the fishing industry, both professional and recreational and abandon this “lock it off” mentality. The fishing industry and the Greens need to stop the chest beating - I believe that there is a lot of common ground that could be reached, however that is going to require that all parties can sit down and have constructive dialog on the topic putting aside their individual agendas and preconceptions about each other. I’d like to think that this could be done, but I’m not holding my breath that it will sadly

Paul Christie said...

So we start out well Andrew... educated engagement with the governmental/political processes and dialogues is essential. the absence of rhetoric would be impossible but the domination of scientifically research based ideas is essential yet sadly missing.

first up yea i blast and hard cause im sick of nice do gooding sweet hearts of the left who allow the debate to be dominated by the aggressive arrogance of the right..and yes your right i should get rid of the insults..i have some anger issues..and find it hard to show respect to someone who starts of with slander and misinformation....To insinuate that the Greens are looneys is insulting enough for me mate...
everything is personal and nothing is...

Capitalism is a fluid concept and should not be considered locked into the corporate dominated free market scenario we are into today. I have never advocated locking Australia up ... i among million others call for a sensible sustainable approach to our activities so that we can ensure that for generations to come we have Environmental security in this Country...so that we may have financial and social stability.

The Notion of perpetual economic growth, the generation of business profit above all else, the application of interest beyond inflation, and the generation of endless credit is a recipe for a suicide pill for the human race and a seriously fucked up planet..

1st the Greens want to lock up some of the oceans...not all of it.
Sure its often some of the best fishing grounds because there ALL THATS LEFT...
The research has proven beyond any reasonable doubt that "locking up" areas has led to a dramatic recovery of fish stock for the areas surrounding it..
If there is no oasis of life in a region its hope of recovery from over fishing in the near future is near to 0.

The Idea that the greens do not consult the other vested interests in an issue is pandering to the media propaganda, i for one know that there is a huge proportion of resources from within the Environment movement that is committed to engagement with those people.

There is animosity from both sides for sure but the prevailing right wing die hard hobbyist/rec fisherman refuse to acknowledge the scientific data and discuss the obvious trends and consequences if we continue to allow self regulation and remove restricted zones.

crying bloody murder and human rights rhetoric is a smoke screen for a "spoilt" brat who thinks they own the oceans and can fish where they like...

Alison Alloway said...

And you people ofcourse instantly believed SADDAM HAS WEAPONS of mass DESTRUCTION. How easy and effortless it is to manipulate the childlike mind....did you bother to research behind those headlines...to find out, you know, if there was anything such as TRUTH to it!!!

George W bin Laden said...

karma's getting closer Australia... see the boat people?.....

grow gardens if hungry....fruit trees ....in every backstreet...

fish eatings over....it buggered up all the old people and most of the rest of youse as well.... it drives ugliness, booze and violence along with tobacco..etc.

proof is everywhere....

if ya kids eat fish then no hope there....

that's correct.....gardens...

T. Asquith said...

Anyone remember the 1973 movie Soylent Green? In an overpopulated futuristic Earth, a New York police detective finds himself marked for murder by government agents when he gets too close to a bizarre state secret involving the origins of a revolutionary and needed new foodstuff.
We're not quite there, though much of the world is.
The days of unfettered fishing are over! The only thing that now has to happen is to get that fact through the thick skulls of those who don't know/don't want to know.

armyboi said...

I am not a fisherman, nor a green's voter, but I find this discussion deeply concerning. When has a minority party decided policy in a democratic country? Ah yes in 1932: Disturbing.

Recreational fishing is carried out by families in the family tinnie or small family boat. Offshore is the only place apart from the rivers and creeks where they can go. You cannot force them further out for safety reasons.

Commercial fishing can be carried out at distances from the coast recreational fishers cannot. We already have bag limits for recreational fishing, isn't that enough? The cost of boat and equipment required by law to be carried is not cheap but to add extra costs with license increases will push many families over the edge.

As for the apparent attempt of the Green Party to convince the voters of the deadly outcomes of Capitalism, well unfortunately most australians including the greenies live in a house built with some form of wood. I am sure their houses were made of recycled timber cut down when the Green Party did not exist. I am a worker and therefore rely on Capitalism to eat and survive. If you think the killing off of Capitalism is the answer to the world's problems, look back into history to the 30's and the unemployment lines, starvation and absolute poverty.

The alternative to Capitalism is Socialism or Cumunism. Worker or not I am not that stupid that I would wish to live under these regimes. No I will take Capitalism over that. At least I have a chance to improve my lot in life.

As for our Labour Government? The winds of change are reaching cyclonic proportions. Enjoy your power at the moment Greens, for it will not last long. You hooked your party to a party heading for oblivion and you will follow them all the way.

Steve said...

armyboi, the points you make are part of a disturbing but quite natural fear of change. Any time you want to sit down for a chat or continue an email conversation feel free to contact me:

stevebrech1@gmail.com or Ph contact: 0427534518

However, the short answer is that The decision relating to fish limits was taken by the Labor Government on advice from scientists. The Greens have no representation in the QLD Government. Therefore were your concerns correct there would have to be a National conspiracy between scientists, the Labor Government and The Greens; this is, of course, not the case.

Your other point is also not valid. Those in power in a capitaist society are, and always have been big business (bankers, miners, industrialists and arms manufacturers) and the 'business as usual' politicians, whoever and whenever they existed.

Capitalists were in power when the world bank told its members to deregulate and gave us a globalised economy. Bank collapse's, unemployment queues and any other result of globalisation like the loss of Australia's manufacturing industry is a result of capitalism. I wish we could have at least some of the power often credited to us but it is not the case.

This leads me to say, Greens have tried to teach consumers that they too can take a hand in directing their purchases that support the small business's, the locally made products and social just purchasing decisions made in our society. The Greens want progress, Greens love technology but what we we want and what Green policies push are major legislation changes that put a price on the consequences of decisions made by big business.

I urge you to think about a better Australia, with full unemployment from sustainble energy, but to get there we are going to have to change the way capitaist currently make their money. To borrow an economic term, we want to "change the levers". Reward industry and business's that don't pollute and economically penalise those that see dumping pollutants into our water supply as an acceptable part of doing business, it is at present.

I'd be interested to know what business you're in as I enjoy hearing from people how your job could be made more sustainable, safer and enjoyable

Steve Brech